Author Topic: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?  (Read 1031 times)

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Offline Rusty Nuts

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Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« on: December 20, 2022, 20:58:05 »

Offline Steve T

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2022, 21:46:30 »
So, smoking is bad for your wealth then!
A weekend wasted isn't a wasted weekend

Offline MartinW

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2022, 05:47:37 »
I see E-Bikes are beginning to spark an interest.
Tall, Dark and Handsome (In 1987) - Just tall now !!

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Online Upt North

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2022, 09:42:52 »
It's the future, let's embrace it.

Offline Barbel Mick

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2022, 10:43:08 »
Flaming heck!!
Mick

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Offline Barbel Mick

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2022, 10:45:07 »
Understatement of the year at 10.25 minutes......
"It's not on fire, it's just overheated."
Mick

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Offline Graham62

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2022, 10:55:39 »
Hot stuff. :clap:
A drunken man's words are a sober man's thoughts.

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Offline Dark-Strom

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2022, 11:44:22 »
That's handy, saves tipping fuel over it and wasting a match...electric motorbike my a r s e ....
When life throws you a curve, lean into it!

Offline Brockett

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2022, 13:46:41 »
Does anyone know how a battery fire can be extinguished?
This doesn't last forever, so do it while you can.

Offline jabmotorsport

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2022, 15:02:25 »
The best method can vary from manufacturer to manufacturer in terms of extinguishing the fire. All batteries come with an MSDS (data sheet) which details how best to deal with it, but the general answer is "with difficulty".
tinker, tweek, fettle....bodge, bang, bugger!!!

Offline Mr Nick

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2022, 15:07:46 »
If it's a lithium fire then not easily is the answer. There are specific powder extinguishers which use copper and graphite and labelled as L2.
I used to go RC car racing and we had buckets of sand around the track to dump on any lithium battery which let go. It had to be kept dry though, as damp sand just blew itself over those trying to extinguish the fire.
Seems pearl asbo orange is faster after all....

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Offline Barbel Mick

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2022, 15:29:56 »
I think a big problem with the batteries on EV's is that they are in a sealed box (probably metal?) which won't let any type of extinguisher fluid/powder/sand etc into the batteries and the fire itself. I also believe, I stand to be corrected, that a Lithium Ion battery would be exothermic and not require Oxygen to sustain itself, therefor even if access was available direct to the source it would still be very difficult to extinguish the fire by 'normal means'.
I've sent a message to ask my Nephew (in Law) he's a Fireman/person/fighter and hopefully he will tell me what the UK fire service plans are.
Or, do we have any Firefighters on here?

Edit...is 'exothermic' the correct word?  :shrug: anyway it can 'burn' without Oxygen being present. 
Mick

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Offline mr_diver

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #12 on: December 21, 2022, 15:31:44 »
I didn't realise they came with a heated seat option  lol



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Offline Mr Nick

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2022, 18:02:06 »
Exothermic just means that more heat is produced than is put in to initiate the reaction.
Lithium batteries which overheat create oxygen themselves, so they are harder to put out. The basic fire triangle tells us we can eliminate any one of the three elements to put it out, but the fuel is the battery itself, and it is creating its own oxygen as part of the failure, so it only leaves heat, so you think that cooling it with water would work. Nope, you really don't want to do that as the heat of the reaction breaks the water down, and provides more hydrogen fuel & oxygen as a result. The same can happen with CO2 if the battery is big enough.
Enclosed lithium batteries where you can't get them out, or properly access them, are pretty much destined to destroy whatever they are in if a thermal runaway happens. I saw a few RC batteries up in flames where someone was dumb enough to overcharge the LiPo in the pursuit of imaginary advantage, the really dumb ones charged in the car... However, these were the same people who blew up NiMH & NiCad cells through abuse as well, it's just that lithium makes the party so much more fun..
Seems pearl asbo orange is faster after all....

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Offline 2112

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2022, 18:36:48 »
Lithium (of all chemistry types) is very difficult to extinguish and can re-ignite several days later. It needs LOTS of water to get it under control but that can lead to shorting out of cells and further arcing and more issues. The biggest danger is the Hydrogen Fluoride gas which is released during a thermal runaway event. This can cause permanent lung damage with very little concentration in the atmosphere and various other problems such as death. One of the many reasons my Tesla Powerwall's are on the outside of my bungalow...
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Offline MartinW

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2022, 18:54:05 »
Does anyone know how a battery fire can be extinguished?

Disconnect one of the terminals :shy:
Tall, Dark and Handsome (In 1987) - Just tall now !!

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Offline Barbel Mick

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2022, 13:34:51 »
It doesn't look as though the fire service have got a definitive answer to the problem of lithium-ion batteries if they catch fire.
The message back from my Nephew (in law).................

"If I turned up in charge of a bike fire that wouldn't go out, I'd say water would put the rest of the bike out and then I'd be looking at foam. If that didn't work we'd be trying to submerge the bike in water somehow. It can be done. We'd improvise! Dig a hole, fill it with water, or maybe a nearby skip. Or cover it in soil?
This year some company came to us with a gigantic fire blanket for car fires and I took part in the demo. It had weighted sides on it. There's always a way mate. And if not, we'd have to sit with it with a spray on it, which we just call a "monitor". Check at intervals until it's out.
Improvise, adapt and overcome.
Then I'd be on the phone to control and getting any further advice from those in our job who get off on this kind of shit."

So, I think it's a case of try everything and if it don't work then get someone else to take responsibility?
Mick

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Offline Rusty Nuts

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2022, 14:44:08 »
This happened whilst charging. The van and car park were quarantined for most of the week in case it went up again.
No Xmas prezzies were harmed.

Offline TLPower

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2022, 16:52:40 »
It's lucky it wasn't parked near a drain or manhole covers that lead to a drain, all those nasty chemicals being washed away would play havoc with the environment.

Oh wait.
To be happy, I don't need private helicopters,a Florida house or a yacht. I'm fine with my motorcycle,a trip to a forest in Bavaria and some lunch money.

Walter Rohrl.

Offline Rusty Nuts

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Re: Who fancies an e-bike for Xmas?
« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2022, 16:59:34 »
I still reckon that windscreen tint's too dark.