What exactly does C45 fault code mean? Contradicting information found!

[kwackboy]

Champy ...
I take it your speedo was working OK..?

[Champy72]

Great! Many thanks for your confirmation.
Went out for a ride today and all is well.
Has to be a damaged sensor...

[kwackboy]

I managed to chat to another technician today who works at a local Suzuki dealership.

I explained the issue, then asked him why it wouldn't throw up an abs fault if the sensor was faulty.

As with myself,  he hasn't delt with such a fault but his theory is the sensor probably is divided in two, internally but can't be 100%.

He also confirmed the slightest damage can make them malfunction.

[Champy72]

I don't believe it!!
After weeks of no error codes, F1 came back on today, and the error code? C45 again!!!
going to have to take it into a workshop now...

[Gert]

  Remembering that previously you stated that there where signs of scoring, have you pulled the rear sensor off again, to determine whether there is any physical damage to this sensor?
  Very strange that the sensor went belly up again. Not perhaps the connector that is possibly corroded, from last replacement to now?

[Champy72]

No scuffing on the sensor, although the sensor wheel does not run quite true. However, no part of it touches the sensor in any way...
Going to see a man who (hopefully) knows tomorrow

[Champy72]

Spoke to my main servicing man, and explained all that had and was happening. He suggested ensuring that when removing the shorting wire in the 2 pins to enter dealer mode, to remove them within 2-3 seconds and this will clear the fault codes. If unsure, insert the shorting pins again and remove within the stated 2-3 seconds.
OK, I thought I'll try that even though I was sceptical.
Jumped on the bike, ignition on and the F1 warning had disappeared!!! Must be the 3 cold starts reset mode...??? Anyway, for the moment, all is well. Again.

[Ianmc]

   If the reluctor ring is running untrue, the ABS module will be seeing different voltages as the metal pieces on the ring pass the sensor,after all that's what the ABS module is looking at, not the speed that the ring is moving past it, because the ABS can be activated at all speeds.
   So it may be that it is sensing wheel speed variations as in a lock up, and that is what is making the C45 code appear.Its a simple job to remove it and possibly straighten it if bent.
   Any idea how it got bent?
   It would be an interesting exercise to measure the output of the sensor whilst the wheel is turning slowly,as in gear on the centre stand.

[Champy72]

Thanks Ian
I will try and straighten the ring (it is out of true by so little), and then measure the output as you say.
No doubt that if a new sensor costs up to £168, the ring will be uber expensive too!!!

[kwackboy]

No need to buy a new abs ring unless it's completely destroyed, remove it and straighten it out on a flat surface.

[Champy72]

Pulling hair out now... 
Took the bike to the main dealer, who checked everything (and sold me a new chain!!) and reset the error code. Great, I thought. 12 miles from the dealer, the error code was back on!!!   
Tried everything on return home but to no avail. 
Took bike in for its 1st MOT, and bloke told me that if it was a car/van etc., it would fail on the EML being on! Also found inner brake pad had 'moved' slightly and was sitting at an angle so only the top 25% of the pad was touching the top of the disc. No fail, as the brakes tested fine.
Jumped on the bike to go home and order yet more parts, and the error code had disappeared!!!
Replaced brake pads and spring clip etc., took bike out for a test ride and still no error code. Enjoyed the next week or so with a clear dash display, until.. yup, error code back on. 
Although the bike runs fine in this mode (no ABS light on, and no strange engine running), it obviously masks any other potential issue.
Annoyingly, Suzuki do not seem to have a technical centre - they just refer you to a dealer.
I'm off to Spain and France in September, and I am now seriously considering getting rid of this bike... Shame. 

[Champy72]

I believe a solution has been found for the ongoing C45 error code intermittent problem on my DL650A 2019.
When a Storm exhaust was fitted, I also removed the O2 sensor and installed an O2 eliminator kit.
C45 started showing up a while after, but it was almost impossible to find out what the C45 error code actually was!! To all intents and purposes it looked like the rear wheel speed sensor was playing up, although no ABS light showed.
Having tried 2 other rear wheel speed sensors were fitted, both with exactly the same issues, and the main dealer didn't have a clue, and Suzuki Technical department just suggested I take it to the main dealer, my patience wore very thin.
Happened to find a snippet from a different forum about a GSXR 1000 that seemed to suffer the same problem, and the code was C45! Although not very clear, he had disconnected the O2 sensor and then reconnected due to the fault code.
I replaced my O2 sensor and within a day, the error code ceased and has not returned...yet.
Since then, I also found that the eliminator plug had only one diode instead of two, and that the one diode causes an intermittent error code that would keep appearing....
Well. That didn't take long to sort!!!
If you ever get an O2 eliminator for your V-Strom, make sure that after a certain year, a 2 diode unit is required.
Topic closed now I hope.

[Brockett]

I hope the saga has come to an end for you. Top detective work and very kind of you to post an update. Well done.

[Rusty Nuts]

As the old adverts used to say "a double diode works wonders, works wonders..."

[kwackboy]

It should have an o2 sensor, that's why you have the fault ....

 

[kwackboy]

Your vstrom must have some electrical gizmo to fool the ecu into thinking the o2 sensor is present, it maybe going wrong .. ?

I appreciate the the c45 code was unclear but surely logic would suggest taking half hour to refit your O2 sensor to see if the problem was the eliminator..?

Would have saved you a mountain of hassle .. 

 

[Brockett]

I don't pretend to understand much (any) of this so I found ....     https://www.hondata.com/?_route_=tech-closed-loop-oxygen-sensors   If I read it correctly the ECU learns over time where the engine is running rich or lean and adjusts the mixture acordingly. I do wonder if, when a mixture problem persists, it might be a sensor fault that can be fixed by installing a new sensor.  I can't see mention of the time required for the ECU to "learn" and make adjustments nor of the degree of "throttle lumpyness" that  is due to engine configuration: single, twin, four etc.
IIRC, the reintroduced V's from 2014 ish suffered from sudden stalling syndrome where the ECU didn't learn and correct the mixture in time.
Hopefully someone who knows how all this works will pop along tell us what is really going on.

[Champy72]

Yes, kwackboy, of course you are right!
However, as I have never had an issue with the removal of the O2 sensor/fitting an eliminator kit on any machine, logic really did not surface in my addled brain!
I have sourced a twin diode eliminator kit, and will see if that works any better...

[kwackboy]

Unless you are doing major tuning to a bike that requires its own custom map via a Power commander there really isn't any gain to be had removing an important piece of equipment that sends vital information to the ECU.

The dealers should have told you the same ..

Yes, sometimes O2 sensors do go wrong, if they do, replace it.

Apologies if it sounds like I'm preaching but a good percentage of bike repairs that come in are from owners tampering with their bikes causing unnecessary costs .

Keeps us in business I suppose 

Anyways , glad you found the source of the problem 

[kwackboy]

Brockett...

Yes, Ecu's on lots of modern bikes have learning capabilities and it's important to reset what is learnt after a major service.

As an independent garage, we have diagnostic equipment that allows us to perform many tests and adjustments,  including a self learning reset but dealers have more capabilities in this area, especially BMW and KTM.

So, imagine removing an O2 sensor ...