Author Topic: Suspension preload and damping force (Read 6342 times)

pichulec · « **on:** February 14, 2018, 20:18:09 »

Hello everyone. Have a question about suspension preload. I read in some place that suspension preload and damping force of rear suspension have critical influence on riding in heavy wind / gusts. What is the best setting for stable riding in heavy wind? I have to say, my bike when I ride in heavy crosswind is trying to change direction. My settings are not standard one I believe. How to go back to factory settings?? Any help will be appreciated.

greywolf · « **Reply #1 on:** February 14, 2018, 20:44:47 »

Suspension settings do not have a big influence in gusty wind riding. By far the biggest thing you can do is to keep a light touch on the handlebars and use counter steering to keep the center of gravity of the bike in the lane position you want. A tight grip will put unwanted inputs to the bars as the wind hits your body. Don't expect the wheels to track straight in gusts. The bike will change lean angle into the wind as wind speeds change. You need to allow the wind to change your lean and consequent tyre position. You are trying to keep your navel in proper position. That is about where the centre of the bike/rider mass is. Riding in windy conditions is like dancing with the wind and it is leading. You need to learn to follow but keep your navel in the lane position you want.

Your suspension needs to be set so when it is fully loaded, including people, each end settles about 40mm down from full extension with the wheel off the ground regardless of other conditions.

wurzel · « **Reply #2 on:** February 14, 2018, 21:47:23 »

Also, leading on from Greywolf large top boxes and or panniers will have a massive input to the wind effect, especially on a side wind.

Gert · « **Reply #3 on:** February 15, 2018, 06:59:56 »

In addition to the good advice provided above, have you considered fitting a fork brace? I have read on various forums that a fork brace on the Wee transforms the tracking in a positive way, but on the Vee, I'm not so sure.
Similar advice to that from greywolf and wurzel, in the threads above on the riding in strong windy conditions, is discussed here: http://www.motorcycleforum.com/101-general-motorcycle-discussion/198338-riding-windy-conditions.html. and http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/v-strom-650-greatly-suffering-on-windy-days.794680/

Gary lad · « **Reply #4 on:** February 15, 2018, 15:22:50 »

How this helps

greywolf · « **Reply #5 on:** February 15, 2018, 15:36:13 »

I'll second the fork brace. It always skips my mind because I never rode without one after I had a tank slapper get off. My mind may be set to think everybody has one.

pichulec · « **Reply #6 on:** February 15, 2018, 17:16:36 »

Already have fork brace

UK_Vstrom650 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 15, 2018, 21:16:09 »

As above for resetting to factory - worth trying that first. Thay said you may need to adjust this further as per GW's advice on sag, and your preference. Depending on the mileage on your bike you may need to refresh or upgrade the the rear shock?

I don't tend to notice much influence shock settings have in strong winds - though I've only ever turned the preload up and down. What I do notice is the topbox, pillion and speed have a lot of influence. As GW said you need to stay relaxed - which can be difficult in brown trouser moments - and let the bike move around to some degree. If the wind is really strong I find slowing down usually helps improve control of the bike.

Good luck with any adjustments

pichulec · « **Reply #8 on:** February 15, 2018, 21:19:50 »

I have big top box and screen with wind deflector, so they both making my bike flying saucer in strong winds :D I will try to play with adjustments, first I will reset to factory settings. Let's say I go maximum clockwise on rear dial, how many clicks anticlockwise is default setting?

greywolf · « **Reply #9 on:** February 15, 2018, 21:45:02 »

The default setting is the third line on the shock body. That being said, forget about it. Almost everybody over 10 stone or with luggage needs more preload than stock. You need to set the sag for your load and weight. See http://www.vstrom.info/Smf/index.php/topic,7132.0.html

Look for about 40mm difference between full extension and fully loaded. It's easiest to measure with two people. The stock setting is for Japanese test riders with no luggage.

sillyboy · « **Reply #10 on:** February 16, 2018, 17:30:50 »

I think that so far my wee is less affected by sidewinds than the gs was but time will tell.

Freddyfruitbat · « **Reply #11 on:** February 17, 2018, 00:46:13 »

Has anybody tried the tip of sticking out your knee in the direction of a strong crosswind? As it happens I got caught out high up in the Peak District yesterday and had some brown-trousery moments with strong wind, and I can confirm it definitely helps. I really don't know why, and you do feel like a right nob doing it (like you're trying to mimic Marc Márquez, but sticking out your left knee on right-handed bends

), but hay...

greywolf · « **Reply #12 on:** February 17, 2018, 02:05:06 »

That keeps you from connecting your body and the bike together, better allowing the bike to move under you. That's all it does.

Loz · « **Reply #13 on:** February 17, 2018, 15:51:55 »

I would think that sticking your left knee out in a right hand bend will take weight off the outside peg and put more weight onto the inside peg, therefore pulling the bike into the corner.

wurzel · « **Reply #14 on:** February 17, 2018, 17:01:20 »

I have used extended knees to counteract side winds on lighter but fast enduro bikes, at speed, it does help Ballance in gusts to interact with them.
Not sure how much it would help on a larger machine, though I have lent my torso into the wind, that has an effect for sure.

greywolf · « **Reply #15 on:** February 17, 2018, 17:38:40 »

Old wives tales. Weighting pegs only makes a difference if you are standing up and the weighting is made by moving the body. Pressing on a peg from a seated position has zero effect on the combined center of gravity or bike dynamics. It's changing the rider's center of gravity by moving the navel to one side or the other that creates a turn input but it isn't nearly as great as a handlebar input. Moving a knee out makes an even tinier center of gravity shift. It's almost unmeasurable. Wind gusts mostly give people problems because they stiffen up and the wind on a stiff body creates handlebar inputs. You want to stay loose and provide the tiny handlebar movements that offset the force of the wind. Here is a small segment from Twist of the Wrist, volume I. There is also a Volume II. Watch those and learn a lot.

Loz · « **Reply #16 on:** February 17, 2018, 19:38:01 »

Loads disagree with Keiths theory, especially this bloke.

greywolf · « **Reply #17 on:** February 17, 2018, 20:03:50 »

What contributes to the bike following the road there is the banking of the road. Most roads are designed to minimize steering input needs. Body movement is a much smaller influence than handlebar input. Try using body movement only to follow a set of curved lanes on a flat surface. An off camber turn would have put that rider into the weeds.

Loz · « **Reply #18 on:** February 17, 2018, 21:02:34 »

So in theory then, my son in law should not be able to do no handed figure of eights on his stunt bike on the flat car park he uses for practice, but somehow with no hands whilst sitting down he can do figure of eights going lock to lock.

greywolf · « **Reply #19 on:** February 17, 2018, 21:41:26 »

With practice, he may be able to do that at low speeds. That's just a stunt. The tighter and quicker the turns required, the more the handlebars are needed in actual riding conditions. Handlebars provide much greater steering inputs much quicker than body movements. I used to practice quick steering inputs while riding in city traffic by avoiding manhole covers as the car in front would uncover their positions. Those are the kinds of inputs needed to counter wind gusts. Try that without the bars.

This thread is about typical riders responding to wind gusts, not what stunt riders can manage. The handlebars will provide much quicker inputs to counter the gusts. No single body position will negate gusty wind conditions. Quick responses are needed as the wind velocity and direction changes.