rear sprocket alignment???

[plumber02]

hi lads ,my gear change is fairly clunky not dry clutch clunky but bad enough I'd nearly be afraid not to use the clutch,I know this subject may have been raised more than enough but I'm confused , it seems to be a 50/50 opinion on this one, on one hand the spacer behind the sprocket seems to fix the prob but I've not taken the wheel off myself to see if the rest are right in saying the sprocket drum thing doesn't sit far enough into the cush drive hub or carrier ( please pardon my terminology- fitter by trade so I just say what makes sense to me ) and if that is so- obviously the spacers inside and outside that sprocket hub is the fix , but then does it not make common sense to also fit that spacer or shims behind the sprocket to realign both sprockets again, if any one has been there will I need to do any machine work on the shoulder of the inside of the sprocket hub to let it sit in far enough ???   

[greywolf]

http://www.vstrom.info/Smf/index.php/topic,1499.0.html
http://www.vstrom.info/Smf/index.php/topic,5341.0.html

[plumber02]

you are the man, again thanks its going to be fun trying to set that hub up on a face plate if it don't work on the mill, I like Your mans thinking of trying to make the extra bearing carrier only thing is it seemed to be just held on with 5 maybe 6mm 10.6 or even 8.8 allens  threaded into about 10mm of metal, nice machine work though - page 12 second link

[greywolf]

Most won't need machining. If it is required to clear a 2mm inset, that can be done with a Dremel tool or drill. It isn't the same level of precision as fitting a second or wider bearing.

[plumber02]

I've got a lathe an have access to a mill it's just time and motivation both of which are limited,pencil grinder with a flat tip would prob work too, all the years I've never actually owned one of those dremil (dentist drills) thingys, also while I'm down there is there anything else wrong with the bloody thing that I might read up on or find out - ie. linkage bearings swing arm bearings any more weak links that I might have to sort out, even though when I put in those shorter links/dog legs I did notice that the rollers were very dry no play but very dry,

[greywolf]

The only thing besides the bearing that comes to mind is the rubber cush pads. They tend to erase themselves from wear and make the carrier wobble, destroying the bearing. They should be replaced or shimmed so there is no play. My rule of thumb is the carrier should remain in place when the wheel is removed and turned sprocket down. If it falls out of the hub, the rubber is too loose.

Oh, there is a fairly rare possibility. It is possible to install the carrier spacer backwards. The bigger end goes toward the sprocket and the smaller end towards the wheel. If it is installed backwards, it will destroy the wheel bearing in short order.

[plumber02]

stripping it as we speak,

[hookie]

The simplest fix is to make or buy a spacer that goes between the sprocket and carrier. I think CYMARC are the people. However it is also worth checking the condition of all other parts of the drive system I.e. chain/sprockets, sprocket carrier bearing and cush drive rubbers and wheel bearings. It's also worth mentioning that chain tension is critical as well and makes the whole thing a lot worse if even a little slacker than it should be.

[greywolf]

This entire thread has been about using an aftermarket spacer with a 2mm offset.

[TimV]

Interesting post, will be following it as I'll probably look into doing this on my Vee sometime. Just wondering, next time I change the chain & sprockets I was thinking of going for a 530 conversion, are there likely to be any resulting clearance problems etc from the wider sprockets with the  different spacer(s) too?

[greywolf]

530 shouldn't be a problem. I know a couple of people who have done it and the original design of the Vee was based on the TL1000 with a 530 chain.

[plumber02]

all back together lads, not ridden yet because our beautiful moist irish weather is catching me , on completing this job I definitely would not recomend putting a spacer behind the sprocket just on it own without pushing the sprocket hub in to the cush drives that 2mm in actual fact to take in all tolerances and crush on all axle spacers the measurement is  2.32mm , don't know if this will sort out the gear change issues but it is something that should be done, fair enough I've got a lathe and this was a piece of p.ss of a job but I would be recomending that it be done , so no matter what all the youtube warriors say this is my 2 cents

[plumber02]

on the 530 chain conversion I wouldn't be bothered there are lads I know out there going back to 525 on 160 bhp gixers 1000 just to get more power, the 1.l strom at its best puts out about 85 maybe 95bhp at the wheel there's no need , I'd even go to say a good DID o-ring with some form of self oiler is as good as an x-ring , I'm running 3 wr's one 250 and two 450's all enduro and honestly even on the 450's I reckon I may get an extra 10hrs more from the x-ring and I'd be replacing them roughly every 8-9 months, if you have ever looked at the difference all that it is that its able to hold more grease inside with having less drag and having a free chain which won't sap power

[plumber02]

just to report - this mod has made a little difference to low gear and low rev gear changes especially dropping down, so it is noticable , my only thing is why the hub spacer mod isn't coming with the 2mm spacer behind the sprocket to bring it back to zero again , I've lined up the rear wheel to swing arm pivot and checked the sprockets and they were perfect, I can see how and why just the sprocket spacer works only that it picks up the chain on centre but in the longterm it must be putting severe lateral strain on the chain , just wondering if anyone out there had tried shimming/ somehow extending the fingers of the sprocket hub to the wheel awkward way of doing it but same affect without changing spacers

[greywolf]

The procedure is trim 2mm off the #8 spacer to move the sprocket in 2mm to get better front and rear sprocket alignment and to lessen sprocket rocking.  Then either replace #9 spacer with a 2mm longer one or add a 2mm washer outside it to get the proper distance between the swingarm sides back.

[plumber02]

I know that , its not rocket science but what I'm saying is the sprockets are aligned straight from the crate  before any mod is done so to zero them again after the mod has been done does the sprocket not have to go back out the 2mm again, or is my bike different , before I changed any spacer I checked the alignment first making sure the sprocket hub was sitting in square and all the way and both sprockets were perfectly in line , so all I'm saying is both the inner and outer spacer mod should it not be done with the spacer behind the sprocket also , or as I said is my bike different

[greywolf]

Master Mike et al maintained the sprockets were not aligned in stock configuration, but were 2mm off, possibly involving the change from 530 to 525 chains going from TL to DL models. Some others disagreed. That belief was the driving force in spacer modification. Part of the problem involves the rear sprocket carrier being rubber mounted caused difficulty in measurement. Most people decided the best check was to see if the sprocket ran down the middle of the chain. There seemed to be some variation between either the bikes or their owner's observations. YMMV. I'd be happy if the rear sprocket teeth were not showing wear on one side more than the other.

[plumber02]

you're bang on what you're saying,I'd love to check another one just to see if they lined up cause I don't think Suzuki got that wrong but definitely for me its a well worth while mod , I've clocked in a few cush drive pumps over the years and if they ran .1 or .2mm off twud be like a ferrit eatin a dirty underpants there'd be f..k all left in an hour , only thing is when you look at it it's not going to cause catastrophic damage and as the man would say what's 2mm between friends we're not making watches, twud do f..k all good added to the lenght of your johnston that for sure, I'd say both mods to most riders out there will have the placebo affect anyway you'd be better off telling them that you've added 2 teflon lined solar powered heat traced fallopian tubes to their scottoiler to make the chain last as long as the piston rings: