Author Topic: new strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away  (Read 67687 times)

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Offline Blade

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #220 on: December 15, 2014, 11:57:21 »
OK, been a hectic weekend, thermal wallpapering,(don't ask). Been in to the dealers and spoke to the head mechanic. He said they had a couple of issues with the early bikes they sold, they,d been on to Suzuki and they issued a bulletin on setting up the bikes. Throttle body settings, tips and suchlike, no reported problems since. I asked if I could have a copy but to no avail I'm afraid. So it seems that Suzuki are aware of the problems and have taken steps. Bottom line is can some dealers be bothered to take the extra time to set up the bikes on delivery.
If you think you can, or you think you can't, either way; you're right.

Offline oddbod

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #221 on: December 15, 2014, 13:40:43 »
Hi Blade,

My dealer undertook those steps when I first reported there was an issue with my bike after a few weeks (back in April this year). I put it in for the 600 mile service and they advised they had contacted Suzuki who advised them to do the above. Balanced Throttle Bodies (apparently they were only slightly out), adjusted the TPS to 28.9, reset the ISC valve.

However, this made minimal difference. Hence the remap, which made a significant difference albeit the idle/low rev problem progressively crept back in over the next couple of months.

Since then, the bike has been back to the dealer more than once, whom advise that because they can't recreate the issue, it is probably rider related and therefore must be fit for purpose.

Unless I hear anything to the contrary via this site, by way of a miraculous fix, then 5 Jan is when I am picking this matter up again direct with Suzuki.
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Offline wunwinglow

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #222 on: December 15, 2014, 15:52:59 »
Exactly as per Oddbod with mine, same suggested tweaks, all to no avail, remap, extraordinary improvement over the stock above about 3000 revs, still problems below that, so mine is currently in Frasers at Gloucester awaiting an assessment. I should hear from them tomorrow or Wednesday what they have found. I'll keep you posted. Overall I'm delighted with the bike, but this poor throttle response and worse at low revs is ruining the bike for me, and unless it can be sorted, I'm moving on..... I've spent almost a year with this, and I think I have been pretty patient!

Tim

Offline Timmo

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #223 on: December 15, 2014, 16:25:28 »
Does anyone refer dealers to this thread on site,they would be a bit hard pressed to give a fit for purpose reply. I take my hat off to you wunwinglow I would find this difficult to cope with without going insane which is why I have still not bought yet.

Offline SimonW

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #224 on: December 16, 2014, 00:19:24 »
Stumbled on this just now, in case it's of interest: http://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/dyno ... -2014-2015 (not that a brand new bike, 3 years in the making, should need it etc etc).

Offline Timmo

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #225 on: December 16, 2014, 00:36:01 »
Looks like a find. :fix:

Offline Blade

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #226 on: December 16, 2014, 07:24:42 »
I agree, having to fork out for this on a new bike to make it behave would annoy me. But it will be far cheaper than the cost to change and it's sellable when you decide to move on.
If you think you can, or you think you can't, either way; you're right.

Offline oddbod

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #227 on: December 16, 2014, 08:18:53 »
If its straight fwd to set the maps and does indeed work. Then I wld buy one tomorrow. The video suggests once purchased you download the map that suits your bikes setup and you can even select autotune so it constantly adjusts itself depending on air density/weather conditions.

Also, I'm a bit concerned whether the power commander would work on my bike as its already been remaped.

Tempting though
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Offline Oop North John

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #228 on: January 14, 2015, 12:50:40 »
Quote from: "wunwinglow"
I should hear from them tomorrow or Wednesday what they have found. I'll keep you posted.

Any news?

Offline wunwinglow

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #229 on: January 14, 2015, 20:44:50 »
Frasers have had my bike on test over the Christmas break, and I've had a loan bike in the meantime, and frankly had I been sold that one, I'd have never had an issue in the first place! Next Tuesday is Swapping Day, when we start moving components between bikes, so maybe by next Wednesday we will know where the problem is located.

I have to say, the loan bike has been a revelation, although I always knew there was a cracking bike underneath the issue. I can't wait to get mine back, sorted! I'll keep you all posted......

Tim

Offline UK_Vstrom650

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #230 on: January 14, 2015, 20:54:42 »
That loan bike sounds like the one I test rode, which had no issues at all. I do hope they sort it out for you AND for everyone else who's had similar issues. Do let us know if they find the cause & fingers crossed  :)

Offline Oop North John

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #231 on: January 14, 2015, 21:15:40 »
Fingers crossed as well  :thumb:

Offline oddbod

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #232 on: January 14, 2015, 21:32:22 »
that's promising news Tim.
Lets hope Frasers identify which component or components are causing the issue.
I for one am very keen to find out so I can check to see whether it is the same component(s) that cause my bike's issue.
Many thanks for sharing your progress.
Beers all round for you if you get this sorted. I'll even ride down to your way to personally thank you.
Well done so far!!
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Offline bosnjo

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #233 on: January 14, 2015, 21:48:21 »
That could be a breakthrough, finally. I can imagine, if the cause was one certain component, dealers will be flooded with owners demanding that particular component to be changed under warranty. Mine cuts like once a week and I ride it every day. But trust me, I'll be taking place in that queue at the dealer's front door as well. I love my bike and I want it to be perfect.
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Offline oddbod

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #234 on: January 14, 2015, 22:01:25 »
Ditto Bosnjo.
And we'll all be able to thank Wunwinglow for his perseverance!!!!
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Offline Roadrocket

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #235 on: January 15, 2015, 20:49:12 »
Its an interesting issue. I have an ex demo bike and never had a problem to date, I must be one of the lucky ones! But I'll be honest, I wouldn't expect to "blip" the throttle at idle on a large displacement V twin and expect the idle to carry on like nothings happened! Hold the throttle for a second to let the engine speed advance well yes, but not a blip. That is different to an engine cutting out when you shut off the throttle during engine braking, or coming to a stop. When I accelerate I always rev the motor upto speed and slip the clutch. When I was a trainee engineer, a mentor told me never labour an engine. Any engine.

I've been thinking about the basic principles of IC engines and why they stall. I've got years of experience in tuning A -series Mini engines on Dynos but not V Twins lol, but I understand the principles of IC engines and they are the same for 4 stroke cycles although today, engines are running literally on air to cope with very tight emission regulations - the result is a nightmare of electronic control and regulation - made even more complex by auxiliary throttles and baffles. The very slightest increase in fuel at idle makes a huge difference to low speed throttle response, that could be one of the reason remapping has helped for some riders. But if owners have to fit a power commander to resolve the issue clearly Suzuki has some remapping to do. My friend had a TDM900 Yammy parallel twin, which had a remapping recall something to do with engine braking and idle issues. The remap made all the difference apparently.

Back firing is usually associated with retarded ignition timing if through the exhaust, if back firing through the air box, then its more than likely caused by a weak mixture particularly on low RPM / or during the engine being under no load.

Just thinking about the basics here...

From my experience if an engine is running too lean it will stall and "knock" from pre - ignition (pinking). If its running rich, it will hunt an produce a regular heavy pulsing exhaust note. One of the techniques for setting up carbs is snapping open the throttle and quickly releasing it, if the engine revs drop quickly or the engine stalls when the rpm reaches idle speed, then the mixture is too lean and needs to richer. One solution is increase the idle speed to establish a better air intake velocity at low rpm

I'm just sharing my thoughts here blokes..(I don't work for Suzuki..) A couple of things to consider with the new 1000 engine, firstly it has a heavier flywheel than any other Suzy V, secondly, the emissions are soo low at idle , I'm suprised the thing idles at all. From my experience, if there was an air leak between the throttle and cylinder head, the engine wouldn't idle full stop on a fuel injected engine or it would stall regularly. On a carb engine, a slight air leak may cause a rise in rpm resulting in an uneven rpm.

I'm thinking along the lines of when the throttle is blipped on the 1000, because of the large displacement and heavier bottom end coupled with the fact that the engine is a twin it won't like "short" low speed blips, particular as the air intake speed and fuel atomisation needs a short time to get regulated. I remember blipping the throttle on my Wee when changing down the gears and sometimes it would back fire into the airbox and miss a beat. Only ocasionally and only when I "blipped". Now  a 4 cylinder or even triple has more power strokes per revolution, resulting in a freer , linear air flow. The cylinder displacement also is smaller.  Any V twin won't take kindly to low speed short term throttle changes, without been given time to increase rpm.

It will be interesting to find the cause of some of the issues Veek owners are having. I'm friends with a local motorcycle engine builder who also has a dyno and years of experience in re-mapping. I'll have a chat with him, I'm sure he will be keen to have a further look.

Offline Timmo

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #236 on: January 19, 2015, 21:36:29 »
Tuesday d-day is nearly here,can't wait for the news wunwinglow!

Offline oddbod

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #237 on: January 20, 2015, 07:56:36 »
Same here. Although wunwinglow said hopefully tues or wed. Fingers crossed for the update and lets hope its a resolution.
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Offline wunwinglow

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #238 on: January 20, 2015, 15:31:14 »
Right! I just got back from Frasers, after they swapped the entire throttle assembly, including the rubber intake boots, fuel lines. Based on a few figures of eight in a nearby carpark, a run round the block and then a blast back home down the A46, the bike is a lot smoother, throttle response is much less indistinct, and there were no rev drops, backfires or farts. I'm going to ride the bike for a week or so to make sure, but hopefully my VStrom is now more or less where it should be. I'm reserving final judgement just yet simply because I've been here thinking it was solved before, and it wasn't!

One other thing Frasers noticed was that there are a number of electrical connectors gathered infront of the front cylinder, on top of a moulded plastic shield above the radiator. All the connectors had some green corrosion on them, so they were all cleaned and proofed with silicone. You can't see them unless you take the tank off, and although I had my bike ACF50 treated not long after I took delivery, this is  obviously something to be watched. And regularly blasted with ACF50, WD40 or whatnot. Even with the shield, wet and road rubbish gets driven in, and because it is so awkward to get at, likely to be missed. I don't know if the actual problem was there, but I thought it was worth mentioning.

So, fingers crossed.  And thanks indeed to the blokes at Frasers for keeping on with this one!

Tim

Offline oddbod

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Re: new Strom cuts out/backfires/stalls on pull away
« Reply #239 on: January 20, 2015, 17:45:08 »
Well that's promising news Tim.
I shall eagerly await your next update in a week or two just to make sure it is fixed before I pay my dealer a visit requesting they do the same.
I do hope you have found the solution for all our sakes but especially yours for being the driving force recently.
All the best and fingers crossed.
Jeff
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